This has been ongoing so Iām taking it out of messages and into an actual post because there isnāt enough room for me to say what needs to be said. Keep in mind that @ross-faer came on to MY post about a blocked follower and decided to start this. Iām finishing it here and now.
As someone who is a licensed psychologist and has worked closely with people in abusive relationships, both the adults in the relationship and the children forced to deal with them second hand, I suggest that anyone who makes up apologies and excuses for abusers seek professional help. If you are so convinced that the treatment of these characters is somehow justified because āone fights backā and they can be treated this way, you need some real help with your reality button. These are fictional characters, but the fact remains: just because one of them fights back or has somehow lashed out at one or another person in this dysfunctional situation, it doesnāt make what has happened to them any less important.
I get that there are Destiel shippers, and Iām not telling you what to ship and what not to. All I was saying was that Destiel, Wincest and those others are dangerous. One Party or another is getting abused and itās usually by Dean. He is the aggressor. Prone to outbursts of anger and violence, he has delusions of grandeur (in that he may have made mistakes, but they were for a common goal and the betterment of others) and while seeing himself as flawed, he continues to act on his impulses rather than consider the thoughts, feelings or safety of others. Dean demonstrates psychopathic tendencies.
When dealing with Sam, Dean puts himself in the place as the protector but in doing so constantly uses guilt and ridicule to control his brotherās actions. Any time Sam tries to do something on his own, whether beneficial or not, Dean warps it into something that Sam has done to insult him or has made the situation unbearable, leaving Sam as the weakened side of the relationship and left to constantly wait for his brotherās approval.
When interacting with Castiel, it has been a horrendous mess since season 5. Cas used to be strong, he had his own opinions, own actions and was in a position to make his own decisions without waiting for his Masterās orders. However, by season 6, Cas is so desperate to prove himself to Dean that he makes wildly unchecked and dangerous decisions in order to show that he is still an Alpha. Dean belittles and berates Castiel, constantly badgering his decisions and actions and finding sometimes not so subtle ways to completely destroy the angel. Once Cas has been broken, thereās no bringing him back to what he once was, only plodding along the same road of denial and abuse by someone who tries to say he is part of the family.
A family does NOT treat their members the way that Dean treats Sam or Cas. But Castiel has never been treated as though heās anything other than a trash can. He has been physically threatened and beaten, mentally abused and broken down until heās nothing other than a broken shell of a man that isnāt even a man! Dean has, on more than one occasion, invited Castiel into the bunker only to turn him out again, citing that its dangerous or it may not be a good idea to have Cas there. Dean has told Sam that Cas cannot be trusted and because Sam is unable to make judgment calls that stand against his brotherās wishes, he goes along with it even though he may not necessarily agree.
Castiel HAS fought back. And he HAS done things to lash out at both brothers. I wasnāt defending or stating that this has never happened. But even in lashing out, he didnāt get out of the situation, all his violence did was get met with a false apology, promises that were ultimately broken sometimes in the very next episode and no lesson learned in either side.
Dean is an abuser. Sam and Castiel are his favorite toys and every time one of them breaks (dies) he finds a way to get them back so the cycle can continue.
Iām done with this conversation. If you are a supporter of this type of lifestyle and still believe that Dean ālovesā Castiel or even his brother in any other way than familial (and thatās even a stretch), it is my recommendation that you contact a professional care facility soon.
If you are seeking the āDean to your Casā you are only saying that you want someone that is going to control every inch of your relationship, you need to realize this is not something to want in your life.
here is the problem i have with the fandom (and the show) acting like dean is suddenly oh so much better to jack now just because he doesnāt want to murder him in cold blood and oh he said jackās not really a monster.
jack: [excited, happy voice] the victim had bite marksā¦ like from a zombie!!! š
dean: [annoyed voice; annoyed look] or ANYTHING ELSE with teeth.
like, this is exactly why deanās an abuser in the first place? itās not just the ābigā things like repeatedly threatening jackās life and saying heās evil; itās the little things, too, like dean always being dismissive, negative, criticizing, disapproving and acting like everything you say and do is wrong.
and i guess maybe deanās behavior is supposed to be blamed on another excuse like āoh deanās an angry sleeper~ā but as cas, who said that line, has also said before: deanās always a little angry. so i donāt think dean being abruptly woken up really gets to be an adequate excuse when heās always that way anyway.
speaking of: virtually every time that cas has been excited about something, deanās shot down his ideas and tried to control him. so itās also not like this is something new at all either. and ~funnily enough thatās exactly what happened with cas in that scene, too, because cas had to sit there and wait for dean to finish his coffee ‘cause dean is the one who gets to decide when they leave.
āYou canāt be scared of someone who is more powerful than youā is a false statement. Itās not about actual power, itās about perception of power. No matter what angelic power he has, Jack is only a child and doesnāt understand how the world works, nor does he understand the nature of his power. Dean lords the threat of anger and violence as an authority figure over him as an insurmountable power. He knows that Jack looks to him as a role model and still chooses to makes threats like āI will kill youā.
Watch again the scene when Sam is confronting Dean about his threats against Jack while Jack is listening in. Jack doesnāt call out to Castiel because he needs help. He calls out to Castiel because heās afraid and Kelly told him that Castiel would protect him. Jack is absolutely afraid of Dean.
dean: *tries to murder a child* *repeatedly threatens a childās life* *drives a child to doubt himself, fear himself, hate himself, think that heās not worth the effort, self-injure, blame himself for his motherās death, think that heās evil, think itād be better if he were dead* *does not actually apologize to the child and takes zero responsibility for his actions* *seriously, he straight up abuses a child for four episodes*
dean: *has literally wanted to murder jack for the last 4 episodes* *has literally been abusing jack for the past 4 episodes* *has driven jack to doubt, fear, hate himself, self-injure, blame himself for his motherās death, think that heās evil, and think itād be better if he was dead* *has made jack terrified of him*
fandom: dean is such an asshole
dean (to jack): āyou did good today, jackā
dean: *doesnāt actually apologize to jack for how horribly heās treated him, doesnāt actually tell jack that he was wrong about him, doesnāt do anything to acknowledge or take responsibility in any way for how awful heās been to jack to jack himself*
fandom: *goes back to stanning dean*
You may not have grown up with a damaged and emotionally broken man, but as one of the very many with a father returned from war (etc) let me break it down. You may have noticed Dean has a difficult time saying the wordsĀ āI love youā andĀ āIām sorryā andĀ āI need helpā. DeanāsĀ āYou did good today, Jack.ā is his way of expressing everything fromĀ āIām sorry for what I saidā toĀ āyouāre not the monster I think you are but I still canāt admit that because if I do and you end up evil I will be completely unable to believe in good in this world and I will have to give up fightingā Ā People like Dean NEED HELP. I pray that if you have a father, brother, significant other, or son who is equally damaged that you help them seek help. But like my Dad, Dean doesnāt feel the need to get therapy. Like my Dad, Dean says that he is handling it all fine on his own. Ā So what Dean does is wrong, but like people who celebrate any show of emotion from a hardenedĀ āmanly manā (ugh), everyone is excited that Dean has taken a step away fromĀ āNO JACK IS BADā toĀ āThanks for this one good thing you didā
dean may be a ~*~damaged and emotionally broken man~*~ (as if every other character isnāt in the same boat but isnāt as awful???), but thatās not the point and thatās not what this is about. dean is a textbook abuser. he is an adult and he needs to be held accountable for his actionsāboth by the show and the fandomāand neither are happening.
dean abused a child for four episodes straight and, while the show did acknowledge that deanās āmessed jack upā and that jack is terrified of him, the conclusion to that wasnāt dean acknowledging how horribly heās treated jack. it wasnāt dean taking responsibility for his actions at all. it wasnāt even dean apologizing (which wouldnāt actually matter anyway because dean has literally said āthe great thing about apologies is you donāt have to mean themā so his apologies donāt mean anything because theyāre lies.) it was dean telling jack that he ādid good.ā dean abused a child and the child he abused is the one who had to earn his trust and respect and acceptance. there is clearly something wrong with that picture. but neither the show or the fandom (at large) are willing to see that and are continuing to make excuses for deanās behavior.
and, as i said, dean is a textbook abuser anyway. the way heās treated jack isnāt even unique to jack because heās abused sam and cas in the same kinds of ways: calling them bad, evil, monsters; guilting them about their mistakes; ordering them around, yelling at them; constantly criticizing and berating them; making them feel like they canāt do anything (or be) right and good. and considering the times when sam and cas (and other characters) have started to have enough of deanās crap and pull away and want to leave that dean suddenly acts so āniceā which ~curiously reels them back in as if maybe that was the only reason why dean was even āniceā in the first placeā¦ dean telling jack he ādid goodā comes off more as continuing the cycle of abuse itself. especially as dean has a 100% chance of continuing to abuse jack as thatās what always happens. because the problem is not the situation and the circumstances at hand; the problem is who dean is as a person and thatās an abuser. but to keep reiterating the point: neither the show or the fandom is willing to acknowledge this and truly hold dean accountable for his actions.
and, sure, dean needs help. but the help dean needs is to learn how to take responsibility for his actions. to admit to his mistakes. to feel remorse and genuinely apologize and mean it. to not be an abuser. but more than all of that: the people deanās abusing need help. their well-being should be placed firstāboth by the narrative and the fandom. but, as i keep saying, neither are happening!! because dean can make jack terrified of him. he can drive jack to doubt himself, fear himself, hate himself, self-injure, blame himself for his motherās death, think that itād be better if he was dead, think that heās evil. but somehow ultimately none of that and all of the pain that jack has gone through because of dean matters and all is forgiven (and forgotten) just because dean told jack he ādid good.ā (which seriously in no way, shape, or form even remotely makes up for the way deanās treated jack let alone redeems dean in any way.)
but i love how dean can spend the last four episodes wanting to murder jack and abusing him but āoh dean said that jack did good~ā so, y’know. who cares about all of that and how dean didnāt even apologize to jack and how he didnāt actually take any responsibility for his actions with him at all.
Urgh yeah. The fandom is disgusting. Dean spend the entire episode being abusive to Jack, not to mention every second he was around Jack since he was born. Even the shifter said Jack was terrified of him. It’s disgusting how this show is trying to make an innocent victim try to appeal to their abuser. Just NO.
I told him the truth. See, you think you can use this freak, but I know how it ends, and it ends bad. You deserved to be saved. He doesnāt. Look, I know you think that you can use him as some sort of an interdimensional can opener, and thatās fine. But donāt act like you care about him, because you only care about what he can do for you. So if you wanna pretend, thatās fine. But me? I can hardly look at the kid. āCause when I do, all I see is everybody weāve lost. And what about Cas? He manipulated him. He made him promises. Said āParadise on Earth,ā and Cas bought it. And you know what that got him? It got him dead! Now you might be able to forget about that, but I canāt!
š„ There is beauty in destructionš„ 